Local Traffic in Mc Burney Park area

[Florence]

I live at the corner of Barrie and Colborne Streets. I think the traffic could be considerably slowed if we allowed parking on both sides of the street. I have seen streets like this in Toronto. I would propose that the signs 'no parking between 10-11 am and 2-3 pm' be removed for one year to assess the success or lack of it in controlling traffic. This is not the suburbs and many residents are regularly ticketed for parking in front of their own homes. I would be interested in hearing what other residents think.

[Dogma]

I find the streets much more dangerous for children etc. when parking is allowed both sides of the street, let alone trying to drive through.

One way street going south (or east) maybe an option, but I am not sure if you are talking about Barrie or Colborne as the issue?. (or both?)

I would also suggest finding out exactly why the no parking times are posted as such. Maybe contact our City for details, before any conclusions.

Alma St. is being changed to a one way street going south. Parking is only allowed on one side for obvious reasons.
i.e park, in addition some homes have no driveways. This should also lessen traffic and speeding on the street.

[Bill(2)]

I believe that you will find that the reasoning behind the one hour no parking window is to stop people from parking there all day long. It forces them to move at least twice a day. A second reason may be that the area needs to be kept clear for transit / traffic / school purposes. The third reason will probably be "It's always been that way." - something I hear a lot of in Kingston since I moved here from Toronto in 2001.

[Dogma]

I certainly appreciate the traffic / parking ideas you have contributed. There are always reasons for something. And in this case probably fairly good ones.

I am also from T.O and have little issues with parking or traffic in Kingston compared to living in T.O.

If I had one I would say - parking infront of the Royal Bank (to go to the bank) downtown is frustrating. Not because there is not enough "spaces" to do so. It's how poorly people park there. They seem to have little idea the size of their vehicles ..maybe because they use Mall parking? I just find it rather common only two cars are parked there, when 3 to four will fit!

Can we have some consideration for the working people that need to go to the bank sometimes? In Europe they would be fined!:p

[Florence]

While it may be counterintuitive, parking on both sides of the streets allows residents to park and slows traffic greatly. I have seen this work in the Beaches area of Toronto, where there are lots of children. Yes the idea is to make cars go more slowly in residential areas. ANd yes it, does allow people to park all day. So? Many of those looking for parking spaces are minumum wage retail workers in the downtown. If we wanted the suburbs we would move there! Try it for a year and see whether you like it. It's not as if this is a lifetime thing.

[Dogma]

I live at the corner of Barrie and Colborne Streets. I think the traffic could be considerably slowed if we allowed parking on both sides of the street.

Sorry - I frankly am still not clear what street you are referring to (Barrie St.?)

I believe the "beaches" in T.O have always had parking on both side of the main "drag". And you could probably consider that area likely more commercial than residential rather than your area in question?

Small stores @ the beaches border the streets and people live above them in many cases...so parking would be a must, for both types of parking users.

I hesitate to ask the McBurney Park Association if they would even consider parking on both sides of the street. Let alone on Barrie Street? I am sure they would have grave concerns. They prefer people taking their bikes, rather than a car for any local transport. The ones coming in from outside the city or from the burbs is their choice where they decided to live and work. (I frankly have noticed many downtown retail workers usually live & work downtown.) They tend to be younger workers that have no car.

I also believe personally; we do not wish parking all day in front of our homes. I find it very disruptive to the area, i.e. car alarms, banging car doors (at all hours) and more dangerous for persons on bikes, seniors & children crossing that is already a main throughway. Let alone they are not allowed during overnight - snowplow season. I hesitate the new presidence - if allowed to park all day/every day if they would move them..as often.

We also have designated parking areas for a purpose. At fairly reasonable rates for a "city". I still have visitors from T.O that have parked downtown comment how inexpensive it is to do so.

If one chooses to "drive" they certainly have that choice. The expense of a car here is very reasonable. My insurance went down almost 30% by moving to Kingston. Almost $ 300 a year. Surely that would help buy a valuable pass for parking? In our municipal lots? But, again I think we should encourage (less) cars not more for the city.

Park on one side of the street or in the parking lot - Ordinance's or in many downtown or uptown locations is avaliable.

I appreciate where you are coming from and the idea of a safe, affordable and possible traffic calming solution...

I also believe there has been improvements in recent years with a new 4 way stop intersection @ York and overhead crosswalk indicators. Colborne Street I also believe is one of the least used east/west roads in the downtown? Maybe parking on both sides there would be fine? Is that what you are asking?

Again; your test would be well worth trying, but I would suggest the "pilot" should be also with other similar type downtown streets. To spread the 24 hour parking around....

[Bill(2)]

Interesting thoughts. Having lived in the "Upper Outer Beaches" before moving to Kingston let me bring a few thoughts to earlier comments.
First, all roads require (and I don't know if it is a Toronto or MTO requirement) enough room to allow two vehicles to pass side by side. So when there is parking on both sides, there are at least two lanes available for traffic. On the side streets, parking moves from one side of the street to the other on a semi-monthly basis during the summer months (it's great entertainment watching the residents run out five minutes before the Green Hornets (parking officers) come along on 'change over' day.) During the winter months the cars stay on the same side of the street so that the snow plows don't get damaged when they bump into a car buried in the snow on the wrong side of the street.
Second, you really had to watch for and READ the parking signs. Trust me, I've never seen anything in Kingston that comes close to the overlapping regulations I've seen in Toronto.

Finally, in the Beaches proper (Queen Street East) a lot of people who live there either don't have a car, or they have front yard parking permits - most front yards there (if they exist) are just big enout to park a mid-size vehicle (at best). Those that have a vehicle just pay for street parking permits (if available) and partake in the daily parking spot lottery. And yes, movement of vehicles is required. Everyone else (including those who have cars) who work downtown Toronto take the TTC (transit) - or even just for getting around.

So, I don't think two sided parking is an option. In fact, it would be two steps back for every step taken forward. Transit is the answer - and no I don't want to start a new discussion on that idea - at least not in this thread.

[Dogma]

Bill (2) good points.

I think though Florence is speaking to The beaches "proper" - not on the outer beaches which is somewhat a different case altogether. .

- Again I am still not sure if she is speaking to "Barire St. proper" or her side streets? So, I must apologies I assumed alot here...

On the weekend there is no two sided parking? For shops and residences? In Beaches Proper eh? And not through the week? Humm..I thought I remembered seeing cars on both sides? (Permit or not.....)

In any event - thanks for the recent Beaches updates...I will pay closer attention next time in that area.


First, all roads require (and I don't know if it is a Toronto or MTO requirement) enough room to allow two vehicles to pass side by side. So when there is parking on both sides, there are at least two lanes available for traffic.

This maybe true in MTO theory..but I differ in reality.

The cars or "minivans" drivers I see on the road especially (secondary type roads) such as Barrie St. or Patrick St.

1) Are in no way obstacles to "the theory"

2) ..but unfortunately the drivers of cars/minivans are "the obstacles" (literally) when parked cars are on both sides.

3) I see many if not most people driving 2-3 feet away from a parked car & thus moves them over the "centre" line, if not in the centre of the road.

4) There is only literally only room for (one vehicle then) to pass through - when parked cars are on both sides.

I see this regularly (each day) - I travel down Patrick St. and others - which allows such parking.


So, I don't think two sided parking is an option. In fact, it would be two steps back for every step taken forward.

Unfortunately; it is difficult especially in Florences area, there are many homes that do not have a driveway for parking. So, its not just the retail workers looking for affordable, permit parking...its the tax paying residences to!!!

As you said - many downtowners - move there to get rid of the car and bike, walk or transit.

But, as you said - This is not mass transit thread!

[Bill(2)]

Well, hello again:

A couple more comments to clarify. First, whether outer beaches or beaches the situation was the same, although intensity did increase during the summer and during festivals in the Beach. And I spent enough time (some nights too much time) in the Beach to see what was happening - and yes, I walked to avoid the parking hassle. There was a shirt I saw there once that said "Welcome to the Beaches, now get the F*** out of my parking spot!", but I digress.

Second, I was talking about legally parked vehicles. Yes, there were (and probably still are) vehicles parked on both sides of the streets, that effectively blocked the street if a vehicle stopped - I can't speak to those pin-heads.

Third, I hafta admit that I have not personally experienced the situation you refer to.

Finally, all in all the problems discussed in Kingston really are not that bad, compared to other municipalities. However, be thankful that this is how big the problems seem to get, therefore we don't need to deal with the issues some others have.

Keep having fun!

[Dogma]

Bill - Hello

Yes, I agree Kingston is certainly not T.O - with respect to parking or traffic issues..and I think the T-shirt slogan says it all.

I think T.O is well past the days of the "T.O the good" (remember that!) and parking and "traffic" are a major issue on either side of the 401 / 400 / 404 corridors.

Yes - I have seen many drivers that (don't know there cars/minvans) and cannot "estimate the size of their vehicle" when parking or driving through narrow parked car streetscapes.... I am sure if one can keep this in mind...next time - you will see lots of examples everywhere not just here.

Again - I am still not sure what street she is referring to for the parking concepts - but as you said it really is a non issue for Kingston.